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Post by paul on Sept 22, 2011 20:12:50 GMT 9.5
..While the one life is manifest in all these planes, The living, social, intellectual contexts of these other planes are ultimately impenetrable mysteries to all but the Most High. Some humans like to think they understand the physical plane. And a few brethren try their hand at penetrating the hidden mysteries of nature and science.
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Post by tamrin on Sept 22, 2011 21:12:03 GMT 9.5
..While the one life is manifest in all these planes, The living, social, intellectual contexts of these other planes are ultimately impenetrable mysteries to all but the Most High. Some humans like to think they understand the physical plane.
And a few brethren try their hand at penetrating the hidden mysteries of nature and science.If in reference to other planes of mind, the latter effort is futile and more in vain than the former. I have however been instructed that, while necessarily and absolutely impenetrable, trying to grasp the truly unimaginable is good mental exercise (like physically pushing against against a cliff face to develop muscle). Consider the analogy of our hypothetical, transcendental liver cell and the impossibility, in moments of apprehending being part of a greater unity, of it grasping even such simple concepts as cleaning our teeth or tying our shoes laces. Such things are not only outside its comprehension, they are outside its reality. The hidden mysteries of nature and science are to be found by reason. This is what scientists do professionally: Psychiatrists specialize in penetrating the mysteries of delusional inner worlds.
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Post by stewartedwards on Sept 22, 2011 22:43:45 GMT 9.5
I have however been instructed that, while necessarily and absolutely impenetrable, trying to grasp the truly unimaginable is good mental exercise (like physically pushing against against a cliff face to develop muscle). Yet I have found it to be doable, at least in terms of the supposedly unanswerable meaning of life questions. Or as I found them by pure accident in daily life, subsequently confirmed to be accurate by some masons and by some older esoteric texts. This is one reason why I have spent quite a bit of time explaining how to find them through the medium of daily life - work, commuting, shopping, casual chats, sports etc. Reason may be a good solid workable method Tamrin, but it most certainly is not the only path to successfully investigate the hidden mysteries. Now I know for a fact that in the SRIA there are people who understand me perfectly Tamrin, and in one case seemed to know my journey well before I did, so there would I hope be some in the SRIS as well. Hence I wonder if you are too focused on one path at the expense of others Tamrin? Not knocking your path, just observing and explaining to you that there are other ways which do work. In my case I simply bumbled and stumbled my way into and through them through dealing with everyday life as noted above - work, shopping, socialising etc. It really is all hidden in the plain sight of everyday life. All you need is the key to unlock it, which in my case was quite literally one day waking up and deciding in my heart to make sense of my life. And hey ho here we are where we are, with some masons calling me a "piece of shit" while others suggesting that it would be wise masons who listened to me, go figure.
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Post by tamrin on Sept 23, 2011 6:14:49 GMT 9.5
Stewart, I do not consider "meaning of life questions" to be impenetrable mysteries. Philosophers have raised competing theories and we may consider some to be more or less applicable to ourselves, as do I (no, I am not going to share them here). Impenetrable mysteries for me include truly knowing the mind of another, whether on this or other "planes." Or even of having more than a vague apprehension of other planes. The "other planes" of which "Paul" writes are the mythosphere of the plane we occupy.
As for reason, I agree that it is not a sufficient condition for wisdom (as it rarely provides anything novel) but it is necessary. In Freemasonry we say that we lead off with the left foot and follow-up with the right. From this I derive the following, personal and unintended metaphorical import: We lead of with the left (intuition) and follow-up with the right (reason). In other words, we test our intuition with reason before taking another step with the left (in which case we would have over-reached ourselves, gone beyond reason and stumbled, perhaps either collapsing in a heap or falling into a fantasy world).
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Post by LorrB on Sept 23, 2011 8:36:34 GMT 9.5
Philosophers have raised competing theories and we may consider some to be more or less applicable to ourselves Theories are theories, experience is experience. It's not too hard to tell those with theories and those with experience. Those who have experienced seem to have a quiet confidence, patience, understanding and a willingness to share 'the Way' with their Brn, whether ridicule or praise be their reward.
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Post by tamrin on Sept 23, 2011 8:40:39 GMT 9.5
It is FROM our experience that "we may consider some to be more or less applicable to ourselves"
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Post by LorrB on Sept 23, 2011 10:02:09 GMT 9.5
Who is 'our' and who is 'we' ??
Are you speaking for all of us, or your lodge/group/society, or from what other people tell you?
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Post by tamrin on Sept 23, 2011 10:12:13 GMT 9.5
Who is 'our' and who is 'we' ??
Are you speaking for all of us, or your lodge/group/society, or from what other people tell you? Inclusive: Life has an existential meaning we each must decide for ourselves (guided by experience and, hopefully, corroborated by reason).
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Post by LorrB on Sept 23, 2011 12:13:10 GMT 9.5
Inclusive: Life has an existential meaning we each must decide for ourselves. BINGO!
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Post by paul on Sept 23, 2011 13:02:56 GMT 9.5
Does this mean that no subject is out-of-bounds for investigation?
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Post by tamrin on Sept 23, 2011 13:29:57 GMT 9.5
(guided by experience and, hopefully, corroborated by reason). Sadly, I don't really hold much hope of that here.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2011 20:14:15 GMT 9.5
There are no supernatural influences. If you think otherwise, try collectively willing me to die overnight or at the very least try to disturb my sleep. You have my permission. I had a great night's sleep.
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Post by LorrB on Sept 26, 2011 8:49:04 GMT 9.5
"Thou shalt not kill"
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Post by tamrin on Sept 26, 2011 9:50:38 GMT 9.5
Apparently, not only wasn't he killed, but the disruption to his sleep, which he requested, didn't happen!?
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Post by paul on Sept 26, 2011 9:57:13 GMT 9.5
I recall a co-worker who dreamed a set of numbers. He wrote them down and then bought a lottery ticket based on them.
The lottery ticket won.
He said that as he had not won a very large amount of money the dream did not amount to anything and so he ignored it.
Such is the nature of proof.
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Post by LorrB on Sept 26, 2011 12:42:41 GMT 9.5
Smithee, if it makes you happy, the next time you wake up in the middle of the night it will be me interrupting your sleep. Ok? It may happen sooner than you think.
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Post by paul on Sept 26, 2011 13:04:58 GMT 9.5
nightmare .... late 13c., "an evil female spirit afflicting sleepers with a feeling of suffocation,"
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Post by LorrB on Sept 26, 2011 14:02:06 GMT 9.5
... nah, wouldn't do that. I was rather thinking about tickling the soles of his feet with my feather ...
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Post by LorrB on Sept 26, 2011 14:06:26 GMT 9.5
Actually - those with the power to do such things must not do so.
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Post by stewartedwards on Sept 26, 2011 16:24:27 GMT 9.5
Apparently, not only wasn't he killed, but the disruption to his sleep, which he requested, didn't happen!? Tamrin, Smithies nievity here I can forgive, but you claim to be a Magus. How in any reasonable sense can you write this This is basic stuff Tamrin, you raised the bar by indicating you were a Magus, so please inspire instead of making school boy error claims. Come on Tamrin I want you to inspire me. Or were you bantering and it went over my head?
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