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Post by paul on Nov 14, 2018 7:33:24 GMT 9.5
>Who would take into account the acquisition of their own will?
This is an interesting question as it presupposes that will is not intrinsic and must be acquired.
I recall when my elder son was about 1 minute old he was taking no nonsense from the obstetrician - lifting his head and fighting back.
I rather think that every intelligence, including cellular, must have some will in order to extract what it needs from its environment.
>What if this whole time on Earth, God has been fulfilling our will left and right.
There is a thought that the bulk of the Earth human race has progressed and the laggards are still on this planet. Are laggards wilful?
Meanwhile, all Will exists within a greater system. For example, when I have had enough of gravity on this planet I am prevented from turning it off.
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Post by sammy on Nov 14, 2018 10:57:23 GMT 9.5
>Who would take into account the acquisition of their own will? This is an interesting question as it presupposes that will is not intrinsic and must be acquired. I recall when my elder son was about 1 minute old he was taking no nonsense from the obstetrician - lifting his head and fighting back. I rather think that every intelligence, including cellular, must have some will in order to extract what it needs from its environment. >What if this whole time on Earth, God has been fulfilling our will left and right. There is a thought that the bulk of the Earth human race has progressed and the laggards are still on this planet. Are laggards wilful? Meanwhile, all Will exists within a greater system. For example, when I have had enough of gravity on this planet I am prevented from turning it off. It poses many other fascinating questions, doesn't it? I agree everything has some aspect of will. Native Americans believe this as well "every thing has a spirit". We have also seen how the acquisition of will doesn't end in our life's cycle either. As a child its smaller things like a diaper, food, attention, etc.. Then will grow into other things like toys. What I am getting at is that we acquire our will. Then immediately start to look for the next thing we "will". We are taught to control this for obvious reasons "coveting material objects". Is there a point to which we are able to satisfy will? Or is will unsatisfiable? Like an always hungry stomach? As you said Paul, a greater system. A force larger than ourselves. We are the speakers of will. Like a hive mind just talking to itself, from different perspectives. Maybe I need to let this whole thought process more, but I'm not sure where to go from there... |
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Post by paul on Nov 14, 2018 12:41:18 GMT 9.5
In the writings of Carlos Castaneda, his teacher, Don Juan, makes the statement that the human mind is a "foreign installation". en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Castanedaarchive.org/details/carlos-castaneda-all-books-in-onePerhaps a more accurate statement is that a foreign intelligence takes up residence in the human mental structure on the subplane 5.4 - at top of the personal mind. This foreign intelligence conceals itself in many ways, not least by explaining that it is us. It is perhaps clearer to refer to that intelligence as the Personal Will. The PW operates to protect itself and it does that by forcing the human personality to operate in a centrally managed fashion. This is a valuable discipline that integrates the human personality at a non-transcending level. (See Maslow) As the junior initiate approaches the 3rd inner initiation s/he learns to control thoughts and thereby learns to control the PW. The PW then is transformed from defense to creativity. There are of course higher wills accessible by the initiate. |
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Post by sammy on Nov 15, 2018 2:50:35 GMT 9.5
In the writings of Carlos Castaneda, his teacher, Don Juan, makes the statement that the human mind is a "foreign installation". en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlos_Castanedaarchive.org/details/carlos-castaneda-all-books-in-onePerhaps a more accurate statement is that a foreign intelligence takes up residence in the human mental structure on the subplane 5.4 - at top of the personal mind. This foreign intelligence conceals itself in many ways, not least by explaining that it is us. It is perhaps clearer to refer to that intelligence as the Personal Will. The PW operates to protect itself and it does that by forcing the human personality to operate in a centrally managed fashion. This is a valuable discipline that integrates the human personality at a non-transcending level. (See Maslow) As the junior initiate approaches the 3rd inner initiation s/he learns to control thoughts and thereby learns to control the PW. The PW then is transformed from defense to creativity. There are of course higher wills accessible by the initiate.
I had forgotten about that part of the book, thanks for that!
I had meant to touch on this earlier. The acquisition and further searching of will, is how these "levels" of will work. Like steps, one leading you to the next. This is why I was asking do they have an end? If it does end, does the final step lead back to the first? Can we trap it in a cycle, as to not get "out of hand"?
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Post by paul on Nov 15, 2018 6:26:19 GMT 9.5
>Like steps, one leading you to the next. This is why I was asking do they have an end?
No doubt they do but I have never seen anywhere near that and do not expect to.
>If it does end, does the final step lead back to the first?
The Entity that uses Existence as its field of experience eventually will have had enough and will remove Existence.
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Post by sammy on Nov 15, 2018 7:26:51 GMT 9.5
>Like steps, one leading you to the next. This is why I was asking do they have an end? No doubt they do but I have never seen anywhere near that and do not expect to. >If it does end, does the final step lead back to the first? The Entity that uses Existence as its field of experience eventually will have had enough and will remove Existence. Remove? Or change/alter? Like the next step... |
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Post by paul on Nov 15, 2018 8:15:04 GMT 9.5
>Remove? Or change/alter? Like the next step..
My understanding is that all the steps and all beings will go out of existence in the same event
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Post by sammy on Nov 15, 2018 11:53:38 GMT 9.5
>Remove? Or change/alter? Like the next step.. My understanding is that all the steps and all beings will go out of existence in the same event The thoughts leading you to this, would you say this is concrete? Or possibly the leading cause "the way things have always been", leaving open the option of something "different" to occur? |
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Post by paul on Nov 15, 2018 12:30:26 GMT 9.5
>The thoughts leading you to this, would you say this is concrete?
Not thoughts, but awareness and perception. Consider that the thread on the 21 steps only describes up to 4.1 but there are references to 1.4 and 1.5. What then is beyond 1.1?
>the way things have always been
Cyclical?
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Post by sammy on Dec 6, 2018 8:56:32 GMT 9.5
>The thoughts leading you to this, would you say this is concrete? Not thoughts, but awareness and perception. Consider that the thread on the 21 steps only describes up to 4.1 but there are references to 1.4 and 1.5. What then is beyond 1.1? >the way things have always been Cyclical? Maybe not breaking the need or use of cycles... But more like making the cylces "cycle" in a new way, or way not yet known.
For instance instead of "going out of existence", it brings life to a new existence in "continuation of" the previous one, and this becomes the new cycle.
Kind of like a final decision on he matter " Do we need to start over from scratch?".
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Post by paul on Dec 6, 2018 9:59:48 GMT 9.5
>instead of "going out of existence", it brings life to a new existence in "continuation of" the previous one, and this becomes the new cycle.
There are layers of cycle, but is there some Entity beyond cycles and therefore beyond Existence?
Such an Entity might manifest Existence by act of will.
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Post by sammy on Dec 6, 2018 23:19:04 GMT 9.5
>instead of "going out of existence", it brings life to a new existence in "continuation of" the previous one, and this becomes the new cycle. There are layers of cycle, but is there some Entity beyond cycles and therefore beyond Existence? Such an Entity might manifest Existence by act of will. With this line of thought, that would make the most sense. Every level would have a "intelligence" behind it.
An answer for this is a long shot, but still introspective I would think.
So we are unsure of the "end", what about the now? At what depth (or even surface) can we interact or communicate with these intelligences?
Like say the intelligence of space?
Or going smaller atoms?
Do they see things in our own fashion? A home planet with a seemingly endless space all around them? Other planets but no life to be seen?
Do we only share "the feeling" of spirit as our phone?
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Post by paul on Dec 7, 2018 5:37:45 GMT 9.5
>Every level would have a "intelligence" behind it.
If you consider the planes of manifested existence - physical, astral, mental, buddhic, atmic, etc - the substance/energy of each plane is the body used by an intelligence, and those intelligences are closely related to the lords of karma.
The lords of the planes are sensitive to communication by worthy humans as is demonstrated daily by skilled tradies on the physical plane, and by various professionals on the astral and mental planes.
>Like say the intelligence of space?
These are not the same intelligences as the lords of the planes, and are more traditionally regarded as the logoi of celestial systems. For example the logos of this galaxy uses the galaxy and all its space as its body.
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Post by paul on Dec 7, 2018 5:41:30 GMT 9.5
> I don't volunteer for anything personally
I certainly follow that principle - waiting until it is obvious that I should be doing something.
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Post by elijah on Dec 7, 2018 7:00:10 GMT 9.5
So we are unsure of the "end", what about the now? At what depth (or even surface) can we interact or communicate with these intelligence?
From my own experience sammy these intelligence communicate when one is ready .. or in my case burning off the excess density which comes with the '' I '' if that makes any sense its really a labor of love truly brother and the strength it takes is beyond anything i ever imagined...
Like say the intelligence of space?
If i could communicate with said intelligence at what level would i perceive its response if the immortal body is part of this intelligence its all linked in order
Do they see things in our own fashion? A home planet with a seemingly endless space all around them?Other planets but no life to be seen?
Intelligence at this level have surpassed emotion and desire or are working there way up to a body for such experience
Do we only share "the feeling" of spirit as our phone? The more progress i make the more i get tested intelligence's are like magnets not all intelligence's may have one best interest....
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Post by elijah on Dec 7, 2018 7:07:56 GMT 9.5
like 10 to 12 ish years ago B4 I got kicked off another / different forum I had Posted Those who want the power don't need the power Those who need the power don't want the power So in retro spect a proper ruler or governor would not apply for the job hence lottery or draft In church I don't volunteer for anything personally & hope for complete crop failure of all my lofty perception ideas I sorta settle for if god wants me to mess with something it gets perfectly obvious that its please deal with this issue & don't expect payment Unconditional love Expects zero in return Isaiah 14:12-17 NKJV 12 “How you are fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! How you are cut down to the ground, You who weakened the nations! 13 For you have said in your heart: ‘I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; I will also sit on the mount of the congregation On the farthest sides of the north; 14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds, I will be like the Most High.’ 15 Yet you shall be brought down to Sheol, To the lowest depths of the Pit. 16 “Those who see you will gaze at you, And consider you, saying: ‘Is this the man who made the earth tremble, Who shook kingdoms, haha right when i need it you come threw fox thank you it gets lonely but im working at it ... Unconditional love Expects zero in return and zero does it get lol but its cool emotions are checked desires are checked and the light shines brighter ..mercy severity are becoming operational and not subjective anymore rejoice! |
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Post by sammy on Dec 7, 2018 7:35:53 GMT 9.5
The more progress i make the more i get tested intelligence's are like magnets not all intelligence's may have one best interest....
Very perceptive Elijah! Magnets indeed. For the most part I think your right, not all have one "best interest". Everything has an interest in something though, and if all levels of intelligence are victims of will. Perhaps there might be "one" thing that all "will" peak in interest equally. |
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Post by paul on Dec 7, 2018 10:44:03 GMT 9.5
>mercy severity are becoming operational
That is good but be careful not to be conditioned by the entity in which the Tree teaching exists. That technique is from an earlier period. I like to think that the Earth system has moved on.
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Post by sammy on Dec 8, 2018 1:51:19 GMT 9.5
>mercy severity are becoming operational That is good but be careful not to be conditioned by the entity in which the Tree teaching exists. That technique is from an earlier period. I like to think that the Earth system has moved on. I agree.
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Post by elijah on Dec 9, 2018 9:29:11 GMT 9.5
>mercy severity are becoming operational That is good but be careful not to be conditioned by the entity in which the Tree teaching exists. That technique is from an earlier period. I like to think that the Earth system has moved on. as the earth system moves on does the tree entity upgrade also ? or is still confined to those older teachings... when i use inner vision the entity seems very old and content .. |
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