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Post by LorrB on Nov 15, 2011 8:25:28 GMT 9.5
The Meaning of John
In esotericism, we say that we have seven vowels, with the M and the S being the sixth and the seventh. That is why the name of John or Johanan, Juan, is disarranged as the seven letters or seven vowels. I, E, O, U, A, M, S. So when we say John, we say IEOUAMS. So in that word, whether in any language, written in any language, we find hidden the seven vowels. Of course the first is the I, the second is the E, the O the third, the U the fourth, and the A the fifth, M, the sixth, and the seventh is the S. IEOUAMS, that is the sound that we say.
Why do we say that the name John, or Johanan, or Juan is related with the Word? Because everything is a crystallization of the Word. That is why in the other Gnostic book, the Book of Genesis, it is written that "God said, let there be light and the light was." In the very beginning. And it is because God creates with the power of the Word. So the whole universe is a crystallization of the Word. That is why in other schools or philosophies, specifically in masonry, they say that in the beginning God geometrisized. And we speak in other lectures about how, when we record the word, our language, in any tape recorder, if we look at the tape in the microscope we discover that the word that we pronounced is recorded on the tape with geometrical figures. So then we discover there that really the Word is geometrical. And when we study matter we will see that indeed matter is formed by different geometrical forms in the microscope, or we will say in the atomic world or molecular world, everything is geometrical.
So behold here also the Gospel of John in the New Testament, which is directly related with Netzach, related with the Eagle (the element Air, the Wind), with the Spirit, and also with the mind. It says:
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God. - John 1
So in this way, this gospel is asserting that God is the Word, the sound, it is vibration. It is not a person, but a type of energy that crystallizes into different geometrical forms. So the multiplicity of forms that exist in the universe are just the crystallization of the Word. But the goal, the end, or the objective of the Word is really to create or to crystallize the human being, which will be the vehicle in order to express divinity. gnosticteachings.org/courses/book-of-revelation/398-introduction-transcription.htmlCan't help but relate these 7 to the 7 officers of a lodge at one level of understanding. |
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Post by paul on Nov 15, 2011 8:53:41 GMT 9.5
Berossus, Babyloniaca F1:
In the first year a beast named Oannes appeared from the Erythrean Sea in a place adjacent to Babylonia. Its entire body was that of a fish, but a human head had grown beneath the head of the fish and human feet likewise had grown from the fish’s tail. It also had a human voice. A picture of it is still preserved today. He says that this beast spent the days with the men but ate no food. It gave to the men the knowledge of letters and sciences and crafts of all types. It also taught them how to found cities, establish temples, introduce laws and measure land. It also revealed to them seeds and the gathering of fruits, and in general it gave men everything which is connected with the civilized life. From the time of that beast nothing further has been discovered. But when the sun set this beast Oannes plunged back into the sea and spent the nights in the deep, for it was amphibious. Later other beasts also appeared.
Thus Oannes (Johannes, John, Jonah) was the first teacher (in the first year) - and thereby taught the first word.
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Post by LorrB on Nov 15, 2011 9:27:46 GMT 9.5
One might see that as a personification of the first post ?
Could also be a case of 'as above, so below'.
What is your take of 'in the first year', and why would Oannes be teaching the first word to someone he is already communicating with?
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Post by paul on Nov 15, 2011 9:34:40 GMT 9.5
I suggest that the usual practice is for later thinkers (brethren) to attach symbolic meanings to (presumed) historical accounts.
If so Oannes is the precursor of John with the higher teachings of Oannes adapted to later religious use.
Even the amphibian nature of Oannes is preserved as the fish-head mitre used by religious teachers
"word" may be allegorical
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Post by Henka on Nov 15, 2011 9:45:31 GMT 9.5
Thus Oannes (Johannes, John, Jonah) was the first teacher (in the first year) - and thereby taught the first word. Y'all really need to stop pulling a Sitchin with words and names. Similarity of sound does not correlate to meaning or origin in other languages. Hebrew is not derived from Sumerian. John masc. proper name, mid-12c., from M.L. Johannes, from L.L. Joannes, from Gk. Ioannes, from Heb. Yohanan (in full y'hohanan) lit. "Jehovah has favored," from hanan "he was gracious." As the name of John the Baptist and John the Evangelist, it was one of the most common Christian given names, and in England by early 14c. it rivaled William in popularity. The Old French form was Jean, but in England its variants Johan, Jehan yielded Jan, Jen (cf. surname Jensen). Welsh form was Ieuan (see Evan), but Ioan was adopted for the Welsh Authorized Version of the Bible, hence frequency of Jones as a Welsh surname. |
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Post by paul on Nov 15, 2011 10:06:04 GMT 9.5
...Hebrew is not derived from Sumerian... Although the alphabet is related  |
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Post by Henka on Nov 15, 2011 10:36:07 GMT 9.5
I don't see Sumerian anywhere on that chart. They all derive from Proto-Cannanite.
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Post by paul on Nov 15, 2011 11:42:17 GMT 9.5
Sumer is not relevant in this context as Oannes appeared from the Erythrean Sea - not from Sumer.
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Post by LorrB on Nov 15, 2011 11:55:13 GMT 9.5
Thus Oannes (Johannes, John, Jonah) was the first teacher (in the first year) - and thereby taught the first word. Y'all really need to stop pulling a Sitchin with words and names. Similarity of sound does not correlate to meaning or origin in other languages. Henka, you do not resonate with Gnostic teachings I take it .. If the gnostics have it right, then what we masons are really looking for is our real selves.. |
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Post by LorrB on Nov 15, 2011 12:06:32 GMT 9.5
Similarity of sound does not correlate to meaning or origin in other languages. Lets play with Jerusalem JerusalemArabic أُورُشَلِيمَ Ūršalīm, Ūršalaym (Ūrušalīm, Ūrušalaym )
Biblical Hebrew ירושלם Yerushalaim probably "Heritage of Shalem" or "Heritage of the Complete"
Aramaic יְרוּשְׁלֶם Yərûšəlem
Biblical Greek Ιερουσαλήμ Hierousalēm, Ierousalēm, Ιεροσόλυμα Hierosolyma, Ierosolyma
Syriac ܐܘܪܫܠܡ Ūrišlem
Biblical Latin Hierosolyma Ierusalem
Armenian Երուսաղեմ / Erousałem
Tiberian Hebrew יְרוּשָׁלַםִ / יְרוּשָׁלָםִ Yərûšāláim / Yərûšālāim
Standard Hebrew יְרוּשָׁלַיִם Yerushalayim
Old Norse Jorsala
Russian Иерусалим / Iyerusalim
Lithuanian Jeruzalė / Yäruzal'eh
Spanish Jerusalén en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_JerusalemSometimes it does? |
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Post by paul on Nov 15, 2011 12:20:34 GMT 9.5
But where was the ancient Jerusalem situated? Certainly not at the current Jerusalem as the site is not old enough.
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Post by LorrB on Nov 15, 2011 12:21:03 GMT 9.5
Why do we say that the name John, or Johanan, or Juan is related with the Word? Because everything is a crystallization of the Word. That is why in the other Gnostic book, the Book of Genesis, it is written that "God said, let there be light and the light was." In the very beginning. And it is because God creates with the power of the Word. So the whole universe is a crystallization of the Word. That is why in other schools or philosophies, specifically in masonry, they say that in the beginning God geometrisized. Every Word, differentiated or synthesized, affects the deva kingdoms, and hence the form-building aspects of manifestation. No sound is ever made without producing a corresponding response in deva substance, and driving multitudes of tiny lives to take specific forms... The majority of human beings as yet build unconsciously, and the form constructed is either of a beneficient or a maleficent agency, according to the underlying motive or purpose of the man. Seems we are all builders in deed Mind is the Builder? (Extract from book Ponder on This) |
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Post by LorrB on Nov 15, 2011 12:53:49 GMT 9.5
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Post by Henka on Nov 15, 2011 13:02:38 GMT 9.5
Y'all really need to stop pulling a Sitchin with words and names. Similarity of sound does not correlate to meaning or origin in other languages. Henka, you do not resonate with Gnostic teachings I take it .. If the gnostics have it right, then what we masons are really looking for is our real selves.. Ahh... but do the Gnostics have it right? There is a wide disparity in Gnostic belief. |
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Post by LorrB on Nov 15, 2011 14:27:00 GMT 9.5
Goodness knows... but I do find their books of interest.
There is also a wide disparity in Christian beliefs, other religions and dare I say, Freemasonry.
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Post by paul on Nov 15, 2011 14:29:38 GMT 9.5
And the 2 Sts John are the traditional patrons of Freemasonry. That is an interesting choice from various perspectives.
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Post by cwhite on Nov 16, 2011 0:17:55 GMT 9.5
Similarity of sound does not correlate to meaning or origin in other languages. Fulcanelli would disagree. |
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Post by Henka on Nov 16, 2011 2:34:08 GMT 9.5
Similarity of sound does not correlate to meaning or origin in other languages. Fulcanelli would disagree. And I would disagree with Fulcanelli, whoever that is. |
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Post by stewartedwards on Nov 16, 2011 4:02:01 GMT 9.5
Ahh... but do the Gnostics have it right? There is a wide disparity in Gnostic belief. As I would lump myself in this category I would suggest that as we are all at different stages of individual paths, that it is not a matter of "who is right". The various structures that flow energy through time which some masons may call tradition, (think about it each structure, whether a particular church, organisation or nation has an "energy flow" of some sort. Individuals then hook up to one structure for support and guidance. So it isnt a matter of one structure being right or wrong, for each is right for different people. And any individual gnostic may have the right answer for them, and possibly for those who are following them on a similar energy flow. The key that many people miss is that as humanity evolves what is "right or wrong" can and does change, and structures must continually find ways of maintaining relevance, availability and accessibility, and not forgetting societal trust. When you start to look at the institutions in our world form this perspective, top down energy wise and how it interfaces with individuals it opens up a whole new world of perspective. Remember also as Einstein said E=Mc2, all matter is energy moving slowly. Funnily enough John is one of my favourite books of the NT. Sorry waffled on a bit. |
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Post by LorrB on Nov 16, 2011 6:54:59 GMT 9.5
Early Christmas present for you Henka... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FulcanelliI think you might rather enjoy acquainting yourself with Fulcanelli ... especially re attuning oneself to the Universe and The Great Work. The secret of alchemy is this: there is a way of manipulating matter and energy so as to produce what modern scientists call 'a field of force'. The field acts on the observer and puts him in a privileged position vis-à-vis the Universe. From this position he has access to the realities which are ordinarily hidden from us by time and space, matter and energy. This is what we call the Great Work." [15]
When Bergier asked Fulcanelli about the Philosopher's Stone, the alchemist answered: "...the vital thing is not the transmutation of metals but that of the experimenter himself. It is an ancient secret that a few people rediscover each century. Unfortunately, only a handful are successful..."[16]  |
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