Contemplating enlightenment

[paul]

It is certainly possible to speculate about enlightenment but I suspect the value of such speculation is limited.

Perhaps there is however some experiential value to be obtained by contemplation.

Here is an image of enlightened human



I wonder what benefits are to be obtained by contemplation of that image.

For example, if we rest our gaze upon the 3rd eye area (middle forehead) of the photo, what effects occur to our 3rd eye?


And what of the eyes? When we look at the subject's physical eyes each have a different effect?

Here is an account from a disciple: "I became aware that his eyes had a strange brilliance and fascination in them. Whenever I looked into his eyes for any length of time, I saw bright effulgence. I was also filled with a strange peace and bliss. "

[vajranagini]

If I knew how to post a picture, I would include one of Shri Ramakrishna Paramahansa.(1836-1886) For those who don't know who he was, he was the spiritual mentor of Swami Vivekananda, who was in his turn, the spiritual mentor of Mohandas Gandhi. The most famous picture of Ramakrishna shows him seated, and looking at the camera with a sort of vaguely curious expression on his face.

In fact he was in a very high state of awareness, just below samadhi, in fact (when he was in actual samadhi, he was so "entranced" that he did not move; one could touch his eyeball, as one doctor actually did, and he would not respond); it could be rightly said that "God is looking out of his eyes".

Ramakrishna never allowed anyone to take his picture when he was "normal", he did not even refer to himself as "I" or "me", but always as "this place" as in "That is not the opinion of "this place", pointing to himself.

When Ramakrishna was dying of throat cancer, Vivekananda was seated by his bed. He was contemplating his master's wasted body, and thought to himself: "Can it really be true that he is God incarnate? " As if Vivekananda had spoken aloud, Ramakrishna opened his eyes and whispered "Are you still so skeptical even now, O Naren? He who was Rama, He who was Krishna, is now the one in this body who is "Ramakrishna"!

[paul]

Here is the code

img]http://www.messagefrommasters.com/Life_of_Masters/Ramakrishna/Ramakrishna%20Paramhansa.jpg[/img]

Just whatever put [ on the start and whatever image link suits

[paul]

There is an interesting difference between the images. One is much more present than the other.

[vajranagini]

Thank you, Paul!

It is a fact, that I learned of Ramakrishna from "Vimalananda", the Aghori Tantric who mentored Dr. Robert E. Svoboda, the first Westerner to learn Ayurveda in the original Sanskrit. "Vimalananda" inspired the "Aghora: At the Left Hand of God" trilogy, and I can literally say that those books (especially "Kundalini", the second in the series) CHANGED MY LIFE. "Vimalananda" said "I have two "touchstones" in my life: Ramakrishna and Gandhi."

[vajranagini]

Oct 22, 2010 10:40:43 GMT 9.5 paul said:

There is an interesting difference between the images. One is much more present than the other.

If you read my post , I mention how Ramakrishna was in near-samadhi when this pic was taken; he never allowed his picture to be taken when he was "in a "normal" state of mind.

[paul]

The difference between the images raises the question:

- Is the objective of enlightenment to withdraw the consciousness from the physical and live largely in the Eternal?

- Or is the objective to draw the consciousness of the Eternal into one's physical life?

[vajranagini]

I would say the FIRST one. Ramakrishna always said; "The purpose of human existence is to know God." Once you have attained this awareness, he said, then the body can stay or go. The fact is, is that human life is deeply expensive in terms of intake of resources, and thus of karma; we are not actually mature before the age of 30! Thus the faster we "progress' the BETTER for us. The Sufis say: "Consciousness first arose in the mineral realm. It then evolved to the plant realm, and from there, to the animal realm. So why fear the shedding your 'human' identity? You will then rise to the 'angelic' realms!"

[paul]

>"The purpose of human existence is to know God."

There is also the concept of humans as co-creators with God.

I am not sure where the concept of co-creator comes from. It might be from Teilhard de Chardin but in any case is a core concept for the New Age movement.

The practice of the mystic uniting with the Source and withdrawing from outer life is perhaps stronger in the Age of Pisces.

[vajranagini]

Oct 22, 2010 10:40:43 GMT 9.5 paul said:

There is an interesting difference between the images. One is much more present than the other.

I remember a saying about this: "Absent to the world but present to God"

[paul]

>"Absent to the world but present to God"

Does God have no work for humans in the world?

Or perhaps God is a male and therefore does not consider multitasking

[vajranagini]

Yes; Ramakrishna said quite specifically that the Divine Mother preferred it when people would join in the "play" (lila) and not be merely satisfied with 'liberation", i.e. that they, despite being free of the obligation to do so, would agree to reincarnate "in the service of the Divine". Aleister Crowley mentions this sort of thing as well: of advanced souls relinquishing all "heavenly reward" and returning to earth again and again to serve a greater purpose.

Another thing that Ramakrishna said, which should be repeated, is that he intended to return in a hundred years (some said two hundred) to collect his devotees,and that "after this there would be no liberation for a very long time". I have already mentioned about the Kali Yuga and its relatively brief duration, compared to the other Yugas (Sat Yuga, Dvapara Yuga and Treta Yuga, respectively) All these are said to be MILLIONS of years long, while the Kali Yuga ( the last in the series) lasts only a few THOUSAND years

. The end of Kali Yuga is known as the "Ghora Yuga"("Fearsome Aeon") because it is 'the end of the world" i.e "Apocalypse", when Nature "clears the board" by whatever means necessary. After that, the demonic element having been purged, and the "devas' put back in charge, the Sat Yuga commences again. The thing with Sat Yuga, however, is that there is no liberation during this time. Or almost none; it takes THOUSANDS of years to 'attain liberation" because "Sat" means 'righteous"; the Divine is completely "in charge" and so spiritual evolution slows to an almost-standstill. So, when Ramakrishna says "there will be no liberation for a very long time", he is almost certainly referring to the commencement of Sat Yuga once again!

It is a FACT that the VERY BEST time for rapid "spiritual advancement is during the Kali Yuga; since it is a time when the demonic is in the ascendent, nobody is interested in the spiritual, or if they are, they are likely to be embracing false, delusional, or OUTDATED creeds. It is also said of Kali Yuga that "God will not be found in the houses of the holy"; that is to say, that conventional religion will be a source of error and delusion, and so faith in such things is certain to be misplaced. However, those who seek God within will be quickly rewarded; God is never closer to us than at this time, and as 'those who know" know: GOD IS IN YOUR HEART.

But, Ramakrishna's warning is clear: TIME IS RUNNING OUT. Once the FEARSOME Aeon commences, "attaining God" is unlikely to be anyone's priority; it is said of this time that "the living will envy the dead"!

Also, it seems to be a general consensus among religions that 'this time the world ends in FIRE". Considering that we have 70,000+ nuclear weapons lurking on the face of the earth, this is not such a far-fetched notion as it was prior to, say, 1945!

[LorrB]

Must admit to not having much time for those sit on mountains contemplating their navels when there is so much need for them in the valleys.

Ramakrishna said, which should be repeated, is that he intended to return in a hundred years (some said two hundred) to collect his devotees,and that "after this there would be no liberation for a very long time".

.. and what about the gentle, loving and kind people of the world who have never heard of him? Bit elitist.

I much prefer the notion that as each is a spark of God, not one single soul can stay 'lost' forever. Sooner or later each will return home.

Re: end of the world. It it blows up, then death will come 'the twinkling of an eye' .. we will be mid-sentance "what the .. ". Won't feel a thing. Anyway, if we can't do anything about anything, why worry about it? Each age has been convinced for one reason or another that it was going to be the last. Maybe it is part of the equation of living... throw a spanner in the works (equation) so that people have to stop and figure out where they stand... ?

[vajranagini]

Correct. Everyone will 'return home' sooner or LATER; BUT "Millions of years in the future" STILL counts as "later". That's the beauty of FREE WILL: one can CHOOSE one's Path OR NOT choose ANY Path, and remain as Gurdjieff put it: "Food for the Moon"; You can CHOOSE to wallow in the material plane and put off your 'liberation"until Ghora Yuga comes along; if you "miss the Kali Yuga bus" you have no one to blame but YOURSELF.

And being a "gentle kind loving person" may affect your karma with other people but it counts for little in terms of spiritual attainment. It is a common delusion that merely "playing nice" is a ticket to heaven; it ISN'T. True, it is important that only "good, moral"people are admitted to the spiritual sanctum, because one then becomes able to have serious effects on the world around you, and 'magickal power' in the hands of a selfish, wicked person can affect Reality in all directions for hundreds of years! Hence the emphasis in Freemasonry on moral and ethical development. But simply being "good" will not ensure your spiritual progress; one has to MAKE AN EFFORT in that direction.

It is said that at this time, if you take one step towards God, God will take TEN steps towards YOU, but YOU must be the one to take that first step! Ramakrishna's devotees made that effort and took that "first step", therefore they have earned his protection. Nothing at all elitist about that, any more than Freemasonry is "elitist"!

Anyone can be Ramakrishna's devotee, even NOW. His method WORKS. And knowing that there are 70,000+ nuclear weapons on the earth lying in wait means "DO IT NOW." It's like this: if I am WRONG, then NO HARM DONE. If I am RIGHT...then if you put things off, you could be waiting to 'return home" for a VERY LONG TIME.

[LorrB]

What about the commandments which can be reduced to two...

Love God and love your neighbour as yourself.

Love has a way of attracting teachers to oneself... both outer and inner. You don't have to leave home to find God. Have to disagree with you that being gentle, kind and loving counts for little in spiritual attainment.

Love of God and a confidence in his Perfect Plan (if I can personalise God for a moment) conquers all fear, even that of death itself.

[paul]

Oct 24, 2010 16:26:53 GMT 9.5 LorrB said:

What about the commandments which can be reduced to two...

Love God and love your neighbour as yourself.

For most humans that is sufficient but not all human souls are of the same origin or time. For example, it is said that some human souls came over from before the pralaya en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pralaya . Some of those souls still work primarily with the earlier energies (intelligence and matter) hence they are less driven to relationships.

Eventually most of those souls will transition to the current system, perhaps with some specialised groups remaining focused in the earlier energies to work with the subtle functions of the planet.

In most humans breath and heart functions have been delegated long ago to lesser intelligences to release the human consciousness to higher work. Similar processes occur with the solar and planetary logoi. Most humans are expected to assist the Logos in its new work, but some will maintain what are now subconscious functions for the Logos

[nventr]

Hello everyone. I'm new here and I just learning the system of this forum.

Paul wrote: - Is the objective of enlightenment to withdraw the consciousness from the physical and live largely in the Eternal?

- Or is the objective to draw the consciousness of the Eternal into one's physical life?< end Paul

I feel that these two questions can be simplified to: Is the goal of enlightenment to expand or contract?

The answer I would give is: "Depends."

Paul wrote: Does God have no work for humans in the world?
Or perhaps God is a male and therefore does not consider multitasking< end Paul

Paul gives us some insight to the question of expansion or contraction in the above answer.

Men or animus-based personalities are by nature single minded. They need to expand their horizons and use their brains in creative ways. i.e. symbolism

Women or anima-based personalities are by nature scattered over multiple responsibilities. From the needs of the different ages and genders of their children to the multiple clubs and support groups to help family, community, and church they need to use logic to compartmentalize and focus. i.e. One thing at a time and fully focus on that one thing for that time.