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Post by paul on Jan 15, 2013 12:21:17 GMT 9.5
But to raise a soul to the point where it has divine fire passing through it, or to be born again, is an extremely tragic earth shaking event. There are some interesting issues here. - What is the soul? - How is it raised? - How can a human raise a soul? - What is the mechanism of the flowing of the "divine fire"?
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Post by paul on Jan 16, 2013 19:42:26 GMT 9.5
>What is the soul? The emotional power center of a human In the kabbalistic tradition the emotional power of a human resides is the second of five levels of the soul Nefesh (נפש): the lower part, or "animal part", of the soul. It is linked to instincts and bodily cravings. This part of the soul is provided at birth. Ruach (רוח): the middle soul, the "spirit". It contains the moral virtues and the ability to distinguish between good and evil. Neshamah (נשמה): the higher soul, or "super-soul". This separates man from all other life-forms. It is related to the intellect and allows man to enjoy and benefit from the afterlife. It allows one to have some awareness of the existence and presence of God. Chayyah (חיה): The part of the soul that allows one to have an awareness of the divine life force itself. Yehidah (יחידה): The highest plane of the soul, in which one can achieve as full a union with God as is possible.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kabbalah#Human_soulThis kabbalistic definition, in Theosophical terms, covers etheric, emotional, mental (higher and lower), heart and will functions. In my view the Neshamah is a close match to what I would call the soul. I would however distinguish the soul body from the solar angel. >- How is it raised? Very carefully > How can a human raise a soul? By asking for divine guidance and protection If the soul is distinguished into body and intelligence then there is much the human can do to nourish the body and encourage the cooperation of the intelligence. >- What is the mechanism of the flowing of the "divine fire"? Awareness of the high energy field that surrounds us, and allowing it to flow while caring for life more than ones self I would also include the effect of intent. A strong intent to the greater good may attract additional flows - some of which may be quite difficult to handle.
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Post by stepnwolf on Jan 16, 2013 22:22:31 GMT 9.5
Thank you, Paul. Your post today cleared up some of the fuzzy areas in my thinking about the nature of the soul, particularly in relation to the qabalistic view.
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Post by LorrB on Jan 17, 2013 7:32:23 GMT 9.5
Neshamah (ðùîä): the higher soul, or "super-soul". This separates man from all other life-forms. It is related to the intellect and allows man to enjoy and benefit from the afterlife. It allows one to have some awareness of the existence and presence of God. At one level of understanding I have always thought of the SW as representing this soul. ie the SW closes the lodge (life-time) when commanded to do so 'after seeing that every bro. has had his due'. Receiving what is due, and closing a lodge, can be seen to be relevant to 'both sides of the coin' - waking, sleeping, birth, death.
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Post by LorrB on Jan 17, 2013 7:38:24 GMT 9.5
>- How is it raised? Very carefully
By step or degree?
I am reminded here of the symbolism of the cable tow and sword.
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Post by LorrB on Jan 17, 2013 7:42:00 GMT 9.5
>-How can a human raise a soul? By asking for divine guidance and protection
"We invoke thine aid ... "
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Post by LorrB on Jan 17, 2013 7:45:10 GMT 9.5
>- What is the mechanism of the flowing of the "divine fire"? Awareness of the high energy field that surrounds us, and allowing it to flow while caring for life more than ones self
Have you experienced 'differences' when at lodge or a religious service?
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Post by LorrB on Jan 17, 2013 7:56:34 GMT 9.5
The soul… is neither spirit nor matter but is the relation between them. The soul is the mediator between this duality; it is the middle principle, the link between God and His form. Therefore the soul is another name for the Christ aspect, whether in nature or in man… The soul is the form-building aspect, and is that attractive factor in every form… which drives all God’s creatures forward along the path of evolution, through one kingdom or another, towards an eventual goal and a glorious consummation. Ponder on This- AAB & DK
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Post by paul on Jan 17, 2013 7:58:51 GMT 9.5
From my very limited observation, it may be that as the initiate advances the entities of the various levels of the kabbalistic soul are no longer required and the system operates in a unified form (body) managed by a single entity that is transparent to Spirit.
Thus Jesus is reported to have said: When you have seen me you have seen the Father for He lives in me and I in Him.
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Post by LorrB on Jan 17, 2013 8:04:48 GMT 9.5
From that same source... The soul of mankind is not only an entity linking spirit and matter, and mediating between Monad and personality, but the soul of humanity has a unique function to perform in mediating between the higher three kingdoms in nature and the lower three. Reminds me of Royal Arch I… seek to assure my fellow pilgrims that the passing things of the senses are but trivial, and of no value compared to the rewards, here and in this life, to the man who seeks to merge his everyday consciousness with that of his own soul. He enters then into the community of souls, and stands not alone. The only lonely periods are the result of wrong orientation and holding on to that which hides the vision, and fills the hands so full that they cannot grasp what has been called “the jewel in the lotus”.
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Post by paul on Jul 10, 2013 9:39:25 GMT 9.5
We speak of young or immature souls. What does that mean?
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Post by LorrB on Jul 10, 2013 11:16:18 GMT 9.5
Imagine a guage - and as you stated in a thread yesterday - Creator one end and Created the other.
I would think of a young soul as being quite near the 'Created' end of the guage. The 'young' yet to gain experience - the 'immature'stuck until they absorb what they need to at that level.
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Post by paul on Jul 10, 2013 11:30:56 GMT 9.5
>a young soul as being quite near the 'Created' end of the gauge.
That makes sense.
I wonder though whether souls progress in a uniform direction. I recall a friend saying that he incarnated to be with Jesus but was killed shortly before that. As a result, he said, his soul went on to a dark path for several lives.
Is is possible for souls to turn from the light?
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Post by LorrB on Jul 10, 2013 13:13:51 GMT 9.5
I would say that we turn away from that with which we are incapatible. Even in an every day sense we shield our eyes from extremely bright lights. This might not be a bad thing either. Seeking the 'secrets of higher degrees' is not encouraged - for our own safety and comforts sake.
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Post by stepnwolf on Jul 10, 2013 19:18:18 GMT 9.5
Imagine a guage - and as you stated in a thread yesterday - Creator one end and Created the other. I would think of a young soul as being quite near the 'Created' end of the guage. The 'young' yet to gain experience - the 'immature'stuck until they absorb what they need to at that level. An interesting idea, but where were these souls when we developed souls were growing our milk teeth, so to speak? Why should there be young souls and old souls existing simultaneously in the same place? I ask the question because those differences seem obvious. I remember attending a carnival in Puerto Rico where many people were insanely drunk, vulgar and boisterously loud. My companion, Puerto Rican born and bred, shuddered and observed, "These are not my people." Why at this stage of human evolution, should such glaring differences exist? I don't recall ever reading about the "creation" of souls. Evidently it's not a big-bang phenomenon: one moment nothing, the next there are souls. Jinarajadasa describes the animal group soul where portions of it may ripen and, pop!, an individual soul emerges, with the animal nature still intact. I think it was CWL who observed that a group of souls enter and leave incarnation at about the same time. Perhaps karma keeps the group together, incarnation by incarnation. Shouldn't we remember, though, that the ideas we toss around in these posts are not engraved in stone somewhere. They are temporary structures that help us understand the soul and its place in a universal plan. Perhaps the differences I see so clearly do not in fact exist. Perhaps it's the short view that creates the differences. When I was just a young whipper-snapper, I was amused and flattered when theosophical acquaintances called me an old soul. In hindsight I think precocious is about the best word to use. "Old soul' has a certain superior air about it which is unjustified. The first molecule of milk coming out of the milk bottle is not superior to the molecule sitting at the bottom. It is super (=above) in time and perhaps place, but not in rank.
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Post by paul on Jul 10, 2013 20:01:24 GMT 9.5
>Why should there be young souls and old souls existing simultaneously in the same place?
According to Theosophy, souls (for humans) were created in both the first and second solar systems. The first group focussed on intelligence and the second on love.
But I don't think that really explains the concept of "young soul"
>insanely drunk, vulgar and boisterously loud..... Why at this stage of human evolution, should such glaring differences exist?
The concept of soul groups might be useful, and group karma.
Also, as St Paul tells us we are dealing with wickedness in high places. There is quite a lot of dark capture of humans at personality and perhaps at soul levels.
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Post by LorrB on Jul 12, 2013 8:58:16 GMT 9.5
What about young students and old students existing simultaneously in the same school?
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Post by paul on Jul 12, 2013 9:08:19 GMT 9.5
If we take the view that humans are actually spiritual entities having a human experience then there may be quite a lot of entries and exits from visitors not part of the major groups. Some of those might not have had much experience with manifesting through a human soul.
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Post by paul on Jul 28, 2013 8:35:38 GMT 9.5
So how would we detect if a human were souless?
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Post by LorrB on Jul 29, 2013 12:40:11 GMT 9.5
I can't imagine a person without a soul.
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